September 8th

[Guest RET.LTC.Skelly=US=]

How many of you are looking forward to the Obama speech on Tuesday to all the schools? Are you excited about writing how you can help the president? Are you ready to answer what the president wants you to do? Personally, my kids will not be attending school this Tuesday, if the school is following the White House's suggested curiculm. They need to first learn civics to understand that the president is not American Government, the people are. And the people do not help the president, he is to administer the peoples will. Once they learn that, then they are ready to listen to the president speech with out me there.

[Guest RET.GEN.Kraor]

LET ME CLARIFY that I am not against the PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES addressing our schools giving positive messages on the importance of education etc. I am against any administration that would instruct the teachers to exercise their authority and influence to coax/foster a belief in the students that they should show any allegiance to an elected official, they should show allegiance to the constitution and the nation. To try and convince them otherwise is both irresponsible and dangerous to the welfare of this country. If Obama is going to talk about the importance of education, staying drug-free, eating healthy, abstenance for preventing STD's and unwanted pregnancy (to teens of course), then I am all for it. But using tax dollars to propogate his ideas to unsuspecting school children would be wrong. I certainly hope he does not do that. On a sidenote: Isn't this a misuse of government funds? I know that is what the democrats said about Bush's pre-recorded message to school children a while back and it was only "stay in school" and "dont do drugs" etc. Ah here it is: [quote]From the Washington Post on Oct. 4, 1991 White House press secretary Marlin Fitzwater came armed to the lectern top yesterday to rebut complaints that the president used taxpayer money for a political event to promote himself as the education president. Democrats are complaining that the $26,750 paid by the Education Department to a private media firm to produce television coverage of Bush's speech to students on education Tuesday was improperly used. The television performance was broadcast live by CNN and other stations around the nation could pick it up by satellite. [/quote]

[Guest RET.SSG.Spartan0189=US=]

Bleh, as long as it cuts into my school day, aw, why not ;) I liked it on Obama's inaguration, we missed half of the day watching it ;)

[Guest EvilWaffles]

Same

[Guest SilentScout^]

[quote='LTG.Kraor','http://clanunknownsoldiers.com/hq/thread/?postID=54827#post54827']LET ME CLARIFY that I am not against the PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES addressing our schools giving positive messages on the importance of education etc. I am against any administration that would instruct the teachers to exercise their authority and influence to coax/foster a belief in the students that they should show any allegiance to an elected official, they should show allegiance to the constitution and the nation. To try and convince them otherwise is both irresponsible and dangerous to the welfare of this country. If Obama is going to talk about the importance of education, staying drug-free, eating healthy, abstenance for preventing STD's and unwanted pregnancy (to teens of course), then I am all for it. But using tax dollars to propogate his ideas to unsuspecting school children would be wrong. I certainly hope he does not do that. On a sidenote: Isn't this a misuse of government funds? I know that is what the democrats said about Bush's pre-recorded message to school children a while back and it was only "stay in school" and "dont do drugs" etc. Ah here it is:[/QUOTE] I Agree

[Guest Deadon]

Mr.Obama will push his radical left agenda on anyone, and that includes school children. My final thoughts on this issue are read the wiki on fascism and the part's about nationalism. I am not against the United States or the President of The United States, however when he blatantly does not obied by or recognize the United States constitution then I have a real problem with the man. The man who has a degree in consitutional law needs to re-read the first part of the constituation which states : "[b][size=18]We the People[/SIZE][/b] of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, ensure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

[Guest echelon]

Wow this seems to be a large issue. Ill have to listen to this speech and see what the man has to say. I agree with LTG.Kraor on this one. When I was in school we always got messages about eating healthy and staying off drugs, etc, but i dont recall any ideas being forced upon me. That would be wrong. What are they afraid he is going to say?

[Guest RET.LTC.Skelly=US=]

Kraor, as always you are right. It is the pledging of allgance to him that makes this sound so much like Fascism. Here I thought he was just a Socialist, instead he's the next Mussalini or Hitler. Right now my K-6 kids are staying home until I hear that their teachers are opting out. To those who are just looking for a reason to not do school work, shame on you. You owe it to yourselves to find out why some of us are upset with this, then make your own decisions. Freedom is precious, men have died seeking it and died defending it. 13 backwater hick colonies turned into a becon of hope an prosperity because of freedom. We have already lost so much in the name of progress, let's not loose anymore.

[Guest RET.SSG.Mason]

Hear hear!...

[Guest Ying]

ahh man i didnt know he was we well half to watch it all day OMG tuesday gonna suck :( kill me now i hate hearing speechs didnt go to school so i didnt half to watch his ignoargration (big word <-- ) they are SOO long

[Guest Ret.Maj.Xander=US=]

Now Skelly you can't start a political debate and not have me chime in. I thought you were above the name calling and the comparison to Hitler. As a retort of sorts I ask if you are one of the people in this picture [IMG]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fa/Little_Rock_integration_protest.jpg[/IMG] Now moving on. The overwhelming red state hate for Obama is starting to annoy me, it seems like every time someone in Washington (R or D) tries to calm everyone down and make sense someone starts shouting "BLASPHEMY" (not literally) and a whole new uproar propagated by Fox News takes over for a week or two. I'm sorry Skelly but pulling your children out of school due to your political feelings is ridiculous in my book. Education is one of the most important issues I care about, because I honestly feel we live in a moronic society and I hope someday the masses will be educated. Taking your kids out of school to avoid having them watch the ELECTED PRESIDENT speak to THEM seems crazy. As a kid I would much rather have the president talk to me instead talk about me. He is being proactive, gaining the trust of the American people, or at least trying. It's hard when you can't go 10 minutes without him being called some name, or compared to someone or some party that has no supporting evidence of said claim. And Skelly c'mon your making this too easy on me [quote] To those who are just looking for a reason to not do school work, shame on you. You owe it to yourselves to find out why some of us are upset with this, then make your own decisions.[/quote]But for your children you know best right? They can't make that decision on their own, but the guys in the US should. How about you expose your kids to more than just your thoughts and your beliefs? Let them think for themselves, and hey maybe you'll get lucky and they will say "you right dad Obama is wrong". At least if they say it then it actually means they thought about it, that they had a choice and it isn't just your chanted words coming out of their mouth. And not all the colonies were backwater hick places, there is a big difference in the intelligence of a New Englander and a plantation owner in the south back in the 18th century. I don't like talking about other peoples families or telling people how to raise their children but since that is the topic and you brought it up I figured I'd bring this up since it supports my claim. Moving on to Kraor [quote]If Obama is going to talk about the importance of education, staying drug-free, eating healthy, abstinence for preventing STD's and unwanted pregnancy (to teens of course), then I am all for it.[/quote]Being from the generation when these issues were being shoved down the faces of students I can comment about these programs you think Obama should talk about. Education is obvious everyone knows that and every president since the 1800s has been saying that we need a good education system. Now I was a member of the D.A.R.E. generation [URL]http://www.dare.com/home/default.asp[/URL] and let me tell you, that is the biggest waste of time and government money I could think of. That might've worked back in 1954 when people still believed the movie "Reefer Madness" as fact, but now a days kids know more about drugs than their elders, and the internet provides them with any information they need on any drug. DARE is a joke and even the brown nosers know that. When I was in High School I got to enjoy one of the benefits of the "healthy eating" movement when they took away all Pop from our school (except for the teachers lounge of course because who cares if they're fat). Anyway it was replaced with fruit drinks like Fruitopia and other such drinks. This was yet another stupid decision pushed from the PTA somewhere because parents are too lazy to watch over their kids health. Healthy eating should be taught by parents, not the government, and honestly most of the "healthy stuff" out there is just BS scams with people trying to get your money any way they can. Example: Organic Food, expensive, no health benefit, and tastes worse and yet people still buy it and claim its better for you. And the big one. Abstinence. Not as successful as both the church and the right wingers have been hoping. Now I know as a parent the thought of your teenager having sex in high school or middle school is completely absurd and you want to make sure that doesn't happen. Well sorry to break it to you parents, but teens do have sex, a lot. Now when I was in middle school kids were having sex, and i know with the cell phone age upon us and the "sexting" craze its just as popular as ever. Kids are going to have sex its built into their genetics, its part of our natural instinct. It would be like switching a lion to salads until it turned 7. Just teach kids to use condoms and be safe. Make it easy for them to talk to you about it and then they would listen to you more. I know a few people that openly talk with their parents about that stuff and its completely normal. I'm sorry Kraor but it seems your supporting the same stuff that didn't work for my generation, and I sure as hell wouldn't want my kids to have to go through such pointless classes, seminars, assemblies, ect. And honestly you're going to pull the misuse of funds when Bush has about $907 trillion of "misused funds" [URL]http://costofwar.com/[/URL] I just can't really see where you guys are coming from, I don't know if its a generation gap or what but I seriously disagree with you on almost all points of this.

[Guest RET.GEN.Darmine]

[FONT=Verdana][COLOR=sandybrown]As a warning! I believe political debates need to be in political forums not here. So I will let this one slide. But if it gets out of hand as in, personnel attacks or flaming of any kind, I will make this post disappear. I don’t care for the political debate post's or religious based posts, [/COLOR][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][COLOR=sandybrown]especially here. And Skelly stop popping up every blue moon just to post some political stuff to get people all heated.[/COLOR][/FONT]

[Guest ArmyGrunt]

Just my 2 cents. I'm not the greatest at explaining what I think, but I will try my best. First, I never like to have political debates with anyone because it ALWAYS turns out bad. For some reason there is no civil conversation, it's always one sided and "I herd this, he read that". On top of that, you don't know if any of the information is true. Anyone can put what ever they like out there and it spreads like a wildfire. Especially with the internet and all. Secondly, I'm only 27, yes I know, young, and I don't know much; understandable. I have served for my country in time of need and would do it again if need be. Some of the best and worst time of my life so far have been from the war. The one thing that comes to politics TO ME, is that there are too many people that can have there hand in anything, and I know that has been going on for ages, but now you hear about this and that everywhere you turn. How do you expect younger generations to vote, which I did not. When you have too much information thrown around, who cares, you don't know what is true. I like to think that I am an open minded person and will try most things once. I try to find my own way and see things for myself and not have parents or friends tell me how I should do something. Let me just say this: when I was returning home from Iraq, my unit and I were in Kuwait with some national guard unit. Low and behold TV got the best of them. A day after we were there, we were being called baby killers from the NG. Your own brothers in arms!!! Spare me please. Since then I could care less about our government, I care about the people I share my life with, and if I have to fight, so be it. You can ridicule or throw remarks, but I don't care what one person has to say anymore. Just go about my life. Ok I'm done. SGT.ArmyGrunt

[Guest Ret.Maj.Xander=US=]

I try to be as civil as possible, if I said anything out of line let me know. I like having these discussion on here no matter the "heat" it brings. This is a very diverse group of people and I'm interested on hearing other peoples opinions.

[Guest ArmyGrunt]

[quote='Ret.Xander=US=','http://clanunknownsoldiers.com/hq/thread/?postID=54949#post54949']I try to be as civil as possible, if I said anything out of line let me know. I like having these discussion on here no matter the "heat" it brings. This is a very diverse group of people and I'm interested on hearing other peoples opinions.[/QUOTE] I try to be as well. I also like to hear other people views. Although sometimes I don't either. LOL

[Guest EvilWaffles]

It was a good speech, listened to it in 9th Period today, I don't have a problem with him addressing us like this, and I thought a lot of what he said was very good information to share with us youth.

[Guest echelon]

Wow, lol. Im not going to use the forums to pour my opinions all over everyone just because I feel like it. If the president is taking a proactive approach and making a change for the good he has my support. Plus I dont think anyone cares to much about this speech here. This is a clan forum not a ranting raving policital forum. I think its totally cool people post their opinions about everything but I dont feel a need to answer back with mine. Can't we all just get along :p. All I know is that I will be serving my country with distinction after I get my college degree. Then when someone tells me how to raise my children I can kick them in the B***S and tell them to go to ****. lmao! This has become a pointless thread because people are gunna begin to get angry when called out by others. I think it should be closed in my opinion. *insert outragious political picture* Bwahaha

[Guest RET.LTC.Skelly=US=]

Xander, Why are you calling me a racist? Do you know my heart? Do really know my views on race? I really found that question if I was iin that picture offensive. You and I have never meet face to face, for all you know I'm a green skinned individual. Please keep race out of it. As for my kids, they are mine to raise and I will teach them my beliefs and values first. When they are ready they can hear others and make their decision, but I will not have anyone undermininig my authority over my children. It's a CoC thing you see. Comparision to Fascism is in the fact that since January, the US government owns banks and car companies. Next they are moving on healthcare. Study the rise of Fascism and the Hitler youth movement, compare them to todays environment. Please do not confuse Fascism with the Holocost, they are linked but you can have one with out the other. Fortunately my kids school opted out so they went. I did get to explain to my 10 year old (not really old enough to see the comparision of Germany in 1938 to today) why Daddy was so upset, and why personal freedom is so sacred and a gift from God (sorry to offend you Xander). She still working it out, but she is now paying more attention to politics and watching her government closely. Oh Xander, I'm the one on the right. ;)

[Guest RET.GEN.Kraor]

First off in regards to the picture. That was a protest in Little Rock Arkanasaw after Brown vs. Board of Education. lets not forget this turn of events September 2, 1957 Governor Orval Faubus (Democrat) calls out the Arkansas National Guard to surround Little Rock Central High School to preserve the peace and avert violence that may be caused by extremists who came to Little Rock "in caravans." September 3, 1957 Judge Davies orders desegregation to start the next day. September 4, 1957 The nine black students attempt to enter Central High but are turned away by the National Guard. September 9, 1957 The Council of [COLOR='Yellow']Church Women [/COLOR]issues a statement [COLOR='yellow']opposing segregation [/COLOR]and deploring the Governor's calling out the guard. It calls for a citywide prayer service for September 12. September 20, 1957 Judge Davies rules that Faubus had used the troops to prevent integration, not to preserve law and order as he claimed. The Governor removes the Guardsmen and the Little Rock Police Department takes over. Its easy to post pictures that incite emotion, I have one of liberal protesters with a sign that say "F#$% the troops", does that signify all liberals hate our troops? I could ask if you are one of them? NEXT POINT. I agree with you Skelly, my kids are raised my way not the Governments way. NEXT POINT Xander, I respect your opinion, but thats all it is.... an opinion. I can tesitify that President Reagans anti-drug campaign/speeches did have an amazing effect on my generation and me personally. It made an impact on several of my friends too which helped them get off of drugs and was a turning point in their lives. It may not have been the only force to help them, but it was part of it. Liberals can make fun of it all they want but the "Just say No" advertisements did have a positive effect on youth and it saddens me that people of a different political persuassion would fight tooth and nail to discredit it merely on the fact that the person who started it was in a different political party. And remember, the message had nothing to do with politics, it was a message and a plea for our youth to stop using drugs because they were better off without them. Organic food is (or is supposed to be) chemical free, no pesticides or herbicides (other than natural). That is what makes it better for you. Abstinence has been a huge success compared to the "lets pass out a condom to kindergartners" plan from the left. The funny thing is abstinence works everytime, no STD's, No unwanted pregnancies. Why are liberals so against it, do they want elementary children having sex? Makes you wonder huh? The money thing was a point for the fact that Democrats yelled foul in 91 so I said hey wait isn't the shoe on the other foot now? I hope the red state hate doesnt get to be equal with what the blue state hate was towards Bush... And Obama is spending as much as Bush ever did.

[Guest Ret.Maj.Xander=US=]

*sigh* First off I posted that picture to point out how you sounded to me with the Obama is like Hitler, or Mussolini, or a socialist(I still can't believe people are on that. Socialists won't call him a socialist.) You reminded me of them because, like them, you have no real claims besides the obscure similarities Fox News can find and then try to smear Obama about. I appreciate the history lesson Kraor, but I do know the history of the south and segregation. And i like how your original post didn't include that bit, you must've hit up a wiki to get the correct dates, science praise the internet :lol: Also, why did u emphasize the church women and how they opposed segregation? Of course they did, hell my grandma goes to church every Sunday for as long as I can remember and watches the guys on TV every day and she was a racist. Upper class white women didn't want lower class African-Americans with their children back in the 1950s? How shocking /sarcasm. Like I said I was in no means calling anyone a racist I was only just comparing you to the right wingers of the past who used THE SAME NAME CALLING in the name of the United States to help promote their feelings towards progress. As for you kids Skelly I agree, I one day hope to teach my kids my values and my beliefs. I just hope when they do get older you do let them make their own decisions. I am completely against the FED, I very much support the fact that it should be audited and in turn dismantled. I support it so much I have written both my congressmen and senator to vote yes to audit the FED. It is terrible to put our money in the hands of an unregulated 3rd party and I feel it is to blame for a large part of our current state. Calling Obama both a fascist and a socialist doesn't even make sense since Mussolini said socialism was a failure and that as a doctrine it's dead. Even so I don't understand the whole fascist thing, it calls for Obama to be an authoritarian figure. Wasn't it Bush and Cheney that wanted more power to the executive branch? Once again Kraor those anti-drug campaigns may have worked 20+ years ago, but not today. They tell us the same crap (which is mostly lies and false facts) to try and scare kids away from drugs. The thing is, the kids know that they are being lied to. Drugs are going to be done by kids, in schools, everywhere and always. Now i'm not saying all kids do, but most kids eventually will. Most kids will drink before they are 21, and smoke some pot in high school or college, and some will even smoke cigs. And yes from my experience with meeting people in college it looks like more people are willing to smoke pot than smoke cigs. Why? Because kids are smart and they know that cigs kill and pot doesn't. So with that fact I will admit to you that the just say no to smoking (cigs) campaign does work because it has facts to support its claim. I could go on and on about this but I'm sure you probably either don't care or don't believe me. But it's the truth. Telling me that the War on Drugs and the ant-drug campaigns are working when I know they aren't, is just more lies from the older generation. I know A LOT about organic food. I did a report on how worthless it is and how the only reason it is still around is because for some reason people will pay outrageous price for lower grade food. But let me make one thing clear [b]Organic food is no way healthier than food grown with chemicals[/b] there is scientific fact to back that up. How would you know that abstinence is a success? Have you gone around every high school and asked students if they had sex? Honestly I would say about 80-90% of students would have sex given the opportunity and thats pretty [i]conservative[/i] (you see what I did there?) All you can do is make sure they are safe about it. And Kraor honestly you think I want kids in elementary school to have sex? Seriously dude, no one thinks that and I can't believe you would accuse me of it. I can't believe you actually think that liberals wants kids in kindergarten having sex? Thats the most ignorant thing I've heard in a while. As for the hate...Obama has gotten 400% more death threats than Bush had. So yeah that dream is lost.

[Guest RET.Capt.MustangMan94=US=]

Quick little fact... Organic foods are grown using older NATURAL pesticeds that are actually worse for you and the enviroment. Oh and yes I would put my life on it. My uncle went green on his farm for a year. That is till the cost went through the roof and he had to charge as much as 9 dollars for a dozen ears of corn. :(

[Guest RET.Capt.MustangMan94=US=]

Sorry om my phone cant edit, but yes all drug and abstinencs programs dont work for everyone. Im an instructor for the army and every person out there learns in different ways. Why cant we just decide on a mix of safe sex and abstinence and let the kids decide which they want. Bottom line if you take a full broad spectrum approach your more likely to catch a larger more intrested adience. Get a kid intressed they'll start asking the questions, it is up to us as parents to listen.

[Guest RET.GEN.Darmine]

This thread is done. If i see one like this again I will warn you one last time. If you proceed to post another thread such as this, i will be forced to ban you or limit your permissions. These arguments are pointless and will go back and forth for days.